Women of War

S2E2 Pt 2: Planes, Trans and Automobiles - Roberta Cowell (The Dillon/Gillies Remix)

(If you are here to find the timestamp to skip over the definitions section, skip from 6.20 to 9.54.)   

Some historical figures are riddles wrapped in enigmas wrapped in a vest, with a great manicure. Roberta Cowell is one of them. Raised as a boy, Roberta Cowell was a racing car driver, nearly an accidental assassin, and a World War II fighter pilot and a race car driver again before realising she was a transgender woman. Thus began her next grand plan to have her true sex (her words) realised, and her body match her mind. 

Thanks to Erin for providing the voice of Roberta Cowell. Erin is a transgender actress, musician and historian based in Victoria. Thanks also to Ben MacEllen for providing the voice of Michael Dillon. Ben is a transgender actor and LGBTIQA+ activist based in Victoria and his website is benmacellen.com. 

This podcast contains discussion of intersexuality, transgender issues, transphobia, gender reassignment surgery, outdated language with regards to transgender and intersex people, brief cruelty to animals, facial injuries, surgery and medical experimentation, war injuries, Nazi atrocities, cruelty to prisoners of war, war rape, attempted sexual assault, and some bad language. 

We have elected to use male pronouns for Roberta before she began her transition, as she herself did in her autobiography. Discussion of Roberta after she began her transition will then use female pronouns. In the same vein, we use female pronouns for Michael Dillon before he began his transition, and male pronouns thereafter. We have however avoided using their deadnames. 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. The fallible nature of human memory must also be considered and is a point of discussion in this episode. Nicola also misstated the year Roberta and her wife divorced, and it was in actuality, 1952. Wales is also part of the UK, she meant to say "Welsh people moved across the border to England." Should Wales be part of the UK? That's a question for another time.

 

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For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. 

Donate to Minus18, an Aussie charity that seeks to educate, empower and support queer youth, here: https://www.minus18.org.au/

Check out Intersex Australia, another Aussie charity that aims to empower intersex individuals and educate endosex individuals. Find them here: https://ihra.org.au/

If you’ve read down this far, you’re hot. Leave us a review on Apple Podcasts and you’ll be even hotter.

For more information on Michael Dillon check out The First Man Made Man by Pagan Kennedy, just not from Amazon if you can. For more information on Dr Harold Gillies, read his Wikipedia page - and there’s a lot about him in Kennedy’s book also. For more information on Roberta Cowell, start with her autobiography, Roberta Cowell’s Story.  For more information about LGBTQ+ people and their experience of serving in the military, check out Serving in Silence by Noah Riseman, Shirleene Robinson, and  Graham Willett. 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S2E2 Pt 1: Planes, Trans and Automobiles - Roberta Cowell

Some historical figures are riddles wrapped in enigmas wrapped in a vest. Roberta Cowell is one of them. Raised as a boy, Roberta Cowell was a racing car driver, nearly an accidental assassin, and a World War II fighter pilot and a race car driver again before realising she was a transgender woman. Thus began her next grand plan to have her true sex (her words) realised, and her body match her mind. 

Thanks to Erin for providing the voice of Roberta Cowell. Erin is a transgender actress, musician and historian based in Victoria.

This episode contains discussion of intersexuality, transgender issues, transphobia, outdated language with regards to transgender and intersex people, facial injuries, war injuries, Nazi peacetime atrocities, Nazi wartime atrocities and some bad language. 

We have elected to use male pronouns for Roberta before she began her transition, as she herself did in her autobiography. Discussion of Roberta after she began her transition will then use female pronouns. 

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

The man Nicola references towards the end of the episode, John Cade, was an Australian doctor and former POW who discovered the use of lithium in treating people with bipolar disorder. Learn more about him in this ABC Conversations podcast:

https://www.abc.net.au/radio/programs/conversations/conversations/7899396

You can also read the book (there’s only one) on Cade’s life, Finding Sanity, by Greg de Moore and Ann Westmore. 

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S2E1: Go-Go Dancing with Bombs - Australian Vietnam War Entertainers

Sequins, go-go boots, fringe bikinis, evening gowns...bombs? Welcome to Season 2 of Women of War where we continue the discussion of the war entertainer, this time in the humidity and red dust of Vietnam. In the midst of the horrors of war, these mythologised women offered soldiers’ a fantasy and an escape from the frontline for an hour or two. Join Hannah and Nicola as they learn what life was like for the women beneath the sequins and bop along to some fun tunes. 

This episode contains references to murder, sexual assault, forced sex work and trafficking, racism and colonialism. It also contains some rude language. It may not be suitable for all listeners.

Women of War is written and recorded on Wurundjeri Land. We pay our respect to Elders past and present, and Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander listeners. Sovereignty was never ceded. 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

An incredible thank you to Lorrae Desmond for her permission to use recordings of her tour rehearsals in this episode and a thank you to her good friend Gael Ballantyne for acting as our correspondent with Ms Desmond. We would also like to thank the National Film and Sound Archive and Angus Johnstone for providing us a copy of the recording itself. 

 

Audio clips from: 

Lorrae Desmond, Lorrae Desmond: Rehearsal Sessions for Tour of Vietnam, Sound Recording, Unpublished, 1965, 390710, National Film and Sound Archive.

David Reginald Combe, Lorrae Desmond Concert Party DPR/TV/1174, 16mm/b&w/sound (Phuoc Tuy Province, Nui Dat, Vietnam, 19 September 1969), https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C273758.

Byron Charles Campbell, 7th Government Concert Party to Vietnam DPR/TV/636, 16mm/b&w/sound and silent (Vietnam: Phuoc Tuy Province, Nui Dat, 16 June 1967), www.awm.gov.au/collection/C256036.

ABC News, Australian Government’s Decision to Send Troops to Vietnam, videorecording/b&w/sound, 30 April 1965, https://abcspla.sh/m/153694.

 

Key resources used:

Siobhan McHugh, Minefields and Miniskirts: Australian Women and the Vietnam War (Sydney: Doubleday, 1993).

Ann-Mari Jordens, ‘Not “Apocalypse Now”: Government-Sponsored Australian Entertainers in Vietnam 1965-71’, Labour History, no. 58 (1990): 65–75, https://doi.org/10.2307/27508983.

Lynne McCormack, ‘Civilian Women at War: Psychological Impact Decades After the Vietnam War’, Journal of Loss and Trauma 14, no. 6 (2009): 447–58, https://doi.org/10.1080/15325020902925209.

John Murphy, A Harvest of Fear: A History of Australia’s Vietnam War (Sydney: Allen & Unwin, 1993).

Mitchell K Hall, The Vietnam War, (New York, NY: Routledge, 2018).

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. Sign up to our newsletter at womenofwarpod.com/subscribe to get notified of the newest episodes plus all the cool things we couldn’t fit into the episode.

S1E10 : The Last of the Samurai - Nakano Takeko and the Jōshitai

Episode ten! Thanks to everyone who has listened so far! We will be back in the week of Anzac Day (the week of April 25th for our international friends). Keep up with us on our social medias - twitter, insta and facebook @womenofwarpod, or check out our website womenofwarpod.com. 

This week on Women of War we’re back in Japan during the Boshin War (aka the Japanese Civil War), 1868 - 1869, and the last fight of the samurai in an ultimately doomed attempt to protect their way of life. Meet Nakano Takeko, onna-bugeisha (female samurai) and the squad of women warriors she led, the Jōshitai. Just don’t lose your head over the ending.

Featuring cameos from everyone’s least favourite Imperial powers - the French, the Americans, the British and the Dutch. The gang’s all here. 

This episode contains references to disembowelment, decapitation, suicide and interfering with corpses. It may not be suitable for all listeners.

All efforts were made to correctly pronounce Japanese words and phrases. We apologise for any mispronunciations. All efforts have also been made to ensure historical accuracy, but as is the nature of historical research, mistakes may have been made. 

This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri Land and we pay our respects to elders past and present, the guardians and caretakers of the land and waters. Sovereignty was never ceded.

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S1E9: Molly Brant and the Haudenosaunee Confederacy - [INSERT HAMILTON REFERENCE HERE]

This week on Women of War Hannah and Nicola decide to include women in the sequel and visit a woman who played an important role in the American Revolutionary War - Molly Brant. Join us as we get a bit philosophical to learn about how Mohawk leader Molly helped convince the Haudenosaunee Confederacy to support the British Loyalists in the war and why. May or may not include numerous Hamilton lyrics.

 

This episode contains references to violence and atrocities committed against First Nations Americans during colonisation and the American Revolutionary War. It also contains some coarse language, it may not be suitable for all listeners. 

 

This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri land and we pay our respects to elders past and present. Sovereignty was never ceded. This episode is set across modern day New York and Canada, or on the lands of the greater Haudenosaunee Confederacy, one of the longest-lasting participatory democracies in the world, which continues to this day. We also pay our respect to the nations within the Haudenosaunee Confederacy.

 

Donate to The Native Women’s Association of Canada (NWAC) at https://www.nwac.ca/donate/

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. Sign up to our newsletter at womenofwarpod.com/subscribe 

 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S1E8: In the Skies of War - Soviet Night Witches (aka Fascists, and How To Bomb Them)

This week on Women of War we take to the skies on a witch's broomstick - or the Polikarpov Po-2 biplane if you want official military terminology. Join Hannah and Nicola as they discuss the first women to engage in aerial combat in WWII, the Soviet Night Witches, and how these women came to bomb the Nazis when women had been bared from active combat roles.

 

This episode contains references to wartime atrocities, aerial disasters and the conditions facing German and Russian soldiers on the Eastern Front during World War II, which were not very good. It also contains some bad language and will not be suitable for all listeners.

 

Women of War is recorded on Wurundjeri Land. We pay our respect to Elders past and present, and any Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander listeners. Sovereignty was never ceded.

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. 

 

Sound Effects via ZapSplat.com.

 

The Internationale in the Russian language. Choir and orchestra of Bolshoi Theatre, conducted by G. Rozhdestvensky, Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons

 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S1 E7: The Real Namesake of Deakin University - Vera Deakin and the Red Cross Wounded and Missing Bureau

This week on Women of War we go all around the world with Vera Deakin (daughter of Alfred, he of the White Australia Policy) as she seeks out missing Aussie soldiers for the Red Cross Wounded and Missing Bureau, including one missing young man in particular. Featuring cameos from John Monash, Harold ‘Pompey’ Elliott, and an accidental defamation of Peter Fitzsimons (since redacted). 

 

This episode contains descriptions of war injuries and what happened to the bodies of the dead during World War I. It also contains some coarse language. It may not be suitable for all listeners. 

 

This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri and Boon Wurrong Land and we pay our respects to Elders past and present. Sovereignty was never ceded. 

 

Thanks to Danielle Broadhurst and Jeremy Johnston for their voice-acting contributions.

 

This episode was in part based on Scates, Wheatley and James’ work, World War One: A History in 100 Stories. The book Nicola discussed, Pedersen’s Anzacs: Gallipoli to the Western Front, is mostly an excellent resource for those curious about Australian military history in World War I, especially for the Sinai-Palestine campaign.

 

Nicola made a mistake when talking about the development of the NHS in the UK being forced by the shortness of British soldiers. Though the development of the NHS may have been driven by this, she meant to say ‘the welfare state’ of which the NHS is part. She also misspoke towards the end and said George Irwin (senior) was quartermaster of Katoomba station; he was not, he was the stationmaster. Thanks again to Dr André Brett for sharing the hot goss on train worker salaries during the war.

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com and sign up to our newsletter or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. 

 

Sound Effects via ZapSplat.com.

 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S1E6 : Under the Skies of War - Edith Piaf

This week on Women of War Nicola and Hannah decide to offend the French one more time and talk about the early life and wartime activities of the Little Sparrow - better known as Edith Piaf. 

 

This episode contains references to alcoholism, child neglect, child abuse, child death, anti-Semitism and atrocities committed during World War II.

 

This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri land and we pay our respects to elders past and present. Sovereignty was never ceded. 

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

 

Nicola has since watched La Vie En Rose, and she cried. 

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. This week we’ll be tweeting a lot of Edith’s sweet tunes, so keep your headphones on!

 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S1E5: Zenobia, Queen of Palmyra - What Haven't The Romans Done To Us?

This week on Women of War Hannah and Nicola go back, faaaaar back to the third century to learn how and why Zenobia, the Queen of Palmyra, took on the Roman Empire. Was she trying to feed her people, protect her son, stick it to the Romans, or build an empire of her own? Listen now to find out! 

 

This episode contains references to wartime violence and suicide. It also contains some coarse language, it may not be suitable for all listeners.

 

This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri land and we pay our respects to elders past and present. Sovereignty was never ceded. 

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies. 

 

Nicola looked it up and septicaemia has no relation to Septimia, because why would it. This being the first time recording in-real-life, Hannah and Nicola apologise for any audio issues - we blame the squeaky table, it will be punished accordingly. 

 

For more information on the podcast, go to womenofwarpod.com or follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. 

 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com

S1 E4: The Declaration of a Female Citizen - Charlotte Corday, the Angel of Assassination

This episode of Women of War takes a look at Charlotte Corday, later dubbed the ‘Angel of Assassination’, who murdered the leader of the Jacobins, Jean-Paul Marat, in the French Revolution. Join us to learn why she did it, and how people saw her actions.

 

This podcast contains references to atrocities carried out during the French revolution, including beheadings and the defilement of a corpse. It also contains some coarse language. It may not be suitable for all listeners. 

 

This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri land and we pay our respects to elders past and present. Sovereignty was never ceded. 

 

All efforts have been made to ensure the accuracy of the information presented in this podcast however with the nature of historical research, there may be mistakes or inconsistencies.

 

Follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @womenofwarpod for updates, sneak peeks and behind-the-scenes shenanigans. Check out our new website at womenofwarpod.com!

 

Intro and Outro Music: Frosty Forest by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com